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i30 N Turbo Upgrade

NULLOBANDITO

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Dec 17, 2018
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Innsbruck, Austria
Jesus Christ, calm down everybody. This is a place to share knowledge and discuss topics - not argue, you can do that in PMs if you wish to.

Keep it civil.

Just gonna cite the relevant rules here again:
"You agree to not use the Service to submit or link to any Content which is defamatory, abusive, hateful, threatening, spam or spam-like, likely to offend, contains adult or objectionable content, contains personal information of others, risks copyright infringement, encourages unlawful activity, or otherwise violates any laws. You are entirely responsible for the content of, and any harm resulting from, that Content or your conduct."
 

marksandygill

Active Member
Jun 6, 2019
128
99
28
Southampton
To be honest the only way to work out if the claimed figures are accurate would be to run a stock I30N (so not Dan's Beast) with each component fitted on its own and then in combination with the other parts to see what effect each has and if cumulative effect is lower...

I imagine much like a computer if you don't upgrade everything you will end up with a bottleneck at some point?
 
Jan 11, 2019
24
32
13
Sydney
I have nothing against Forge or any other products, but I just can´t look how companies are making their marketing campains. I am pretty sure that there will be not less buyers if they weren´t so loud with unrealistic numbers.
Why I feel that most of nice nubers are not real? Ok, I will try to explain and give examples:
First of all, lets make clear that there has been 2 cars, Forge has been using for testing their products and I will use numbers announced on their blog as a base:
https://www.forgemotorsport.co.uk/T...b4Du4ZoxNmIOONQoJEWWyk7zRb8IEyOhMd_w1bnBblIg8

Car nr. 1 (not Dan´s)
Forge has been using that car for testing their intercooler and their cold air intake. Unfortunately that car had aftermarket cat back exhaust and car was not measured before installing that cat back.

First Forge released their cold air intake system.
https://www.forgemotorsport.co.uk/Induction_Kit_for_Hyundai_i30N_and_Veloster_N--product--1714.html
Lets do not forget that car had aftermarket cat back exhaust installed! There is no before run dyno sheet available (they just wrote that factory spec car makes 275bhp and 278lb.ft of torque), there is only dyno sheet after installing Forge CAI, what shows that car made 296,6bhp and 310,8lb.ft of torque. It is not known how much from that 21,6 gained hp was achieved by Forge CAI and how much by cat back exhaust. The result achieved - +21,6bhp and 32,8lb.ft

That same car has been used for testing their intercooler.
https://www.forgemotorsport.co.uk/U...undai_i30n_and_Veloster_N--product--1713.html
Car had aftermarket cat back exhaust installed and also their intake system. So we can take 296,6bhp and 310,8lb.ft as a base. On same Lithfield dyno, they managed to gain these numbers to 307,0bhp and 347,4lb.ft. The result achieved - +10,4bhp and 36,6lb.ft

If I will now count together everything, Forge managed to gain stock values by +32bhp and + 69,4lb.ft

Car nr. 2 - Dan´s car
It was used for measuring Forge turbo inlet pipe. Car had intercooler and intake already installed, but instead of cat back, Dan´s car has aftermarket downpipe installed. Because Dan´s car was measured before on other dyno (Regals), they made before run also on Lichfield dyno. If Dan´s car made 305,1bhp and 367,8lb.ft on Regal dyno with remap, same car made 310,6bhp and 325,8lb.ft on Litchfield dyno. After installing Forge turbo inlet pipe, car made 323,1bhp and 329,6lb.ft. The result achieved - +12,5bhp and 3,8lb.ft. It is the only result I can belive because Dan´s car has remap. On stock car it will not give so big effect.

Another interesting thing is the difference between 2 dynos -
Regal - 305,1bhp @ 5067rpm and 367,8lb.ft @ 3459rpm
Litchfield - 310,6bhp @ 6580rpm and only 325,8lb.ft. @ 4025rpm
For me it shows that Dan´s car was measured on diffrent gear or Litchfield dyno has completely diffrent settings than Regal has on their dyno.
If I will look the dyno graph of my own stock car and compare it with Regal´s first dyno sheet, I can see that power is the same 278bhp on same rpm and torque is also the same and on same rpm-s.
It is the reason why I trust Regal´s dyno result more than Litchfields. Our stock turbocharger is not producing it peak power on 6580rpm, my car with upgrade turbocharger is producing its peak power on 6300 rpm-s and my 321,4bhp remap with stock turbocharger had its peak power on 5415rpm-s.
@Dan_bush27 - can you confirm that Litchfield did not touch your ECU?
It is not normal that after installing turbo inlet pipe, peak power point moves from 6580rpm-s down to 5830rpm and I don´t understand why they need to change measurement units between 2 runs?
View attachment 8970

Ok, lets see what kind of results Dan has seen with Forge CAI and intercooler:

26.02.2019 Dan installed Forge CAI, BOV and oil cap.
14.03.2019 Dan´s car went to Regal and he wrote that his base run was done and his car made 278hp and 286,4 ft.lbs. That base run was done with Forge CAI installed to his car !!! I can´t see any +20hp gains here what Forge will promise.
Same day (14.03.2019) Forge intercooler was also installed to his car.
And next day aftermarket downpipe was also installed.
25.03.2019 Dan´s car went back to Regal (Forge IC, Forge CAI and aftermarket DP). There is no dyno sheet from pre run but he wrote that measured base power before remap, was 286bhp (no information about torque). 286-278 = 8bhp
Lets assume that Dan´s car came from factory with 275bhp like most of stock i30n-s are making.
He installed Forge CAI, Forge IC and 200cpsi cat aftermarket downpipe.
For stock car downpipe gave +8bhp and Forge CAI+IC +1bhp.
It is the same what I have experienced by myself, after installing similar items like Dan and it is the reason why my mind refuses to belive that combination of Forge CAI, IC and aftermarket cat back gives magical +32bhp and + 69,4lb.ft

In my oppinion Forge just forgot to mention that both times when they installed CAI and IC, ECU of car was also moddified or car had tuning box.
It will be fair enough to me if they had just mention that all these numbers can be achievable only together with remap.
I agree with all of this. I'd also add that dyno sheets are not comparable expert to them selves. Unless I see a calibration certificate I don't trust the numbers. At a garage I worked in our dyno consistently read 40bhp highr than stock. So we were not surprised when we went to dyno days and got different results. I am dubious to forges claims as they never provided a base dyno sheet and just stock figure.
 

Whiteluxsun

Active Member
Apr 30, 2018
199
142
43
Australia
yep, they are.

the guys from klasen motors differentiate between modifying your turbo (~1300€) and modifying a new one (~2800€)...so expensive nonetheless
Seems like everything is so expensive in your country, the turbo upgrade done by gcg Australia on the oem turbo is $1250aud (£690) we have intakes made at local fab for $450aud (£250) xforce downpipe $894aud (£490) this is why i laugh at forge new turbo inlet price. I have already sent template to local fab for the flange $80aud (£40) and silcone hose $30aud..
 

without

Well-Known Member
Jan 17, 2019
365
352
63
Germany
I dont know about australian regulations but what makes stuff very expensive here in germany is the certicate to run parts legally on the street. For example, you can get a catless downpipe for 300€ or a non-street legal downpipe with cat for 750€, but the street legal version will be twice that.
 
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1FastStagea

Well-Known Member
Nthusiast
Dec 9, 2018
493
767
93
Canada
Seems like everything is so expensive in your country, the turbo upgrade done by gcg Australia on the oem turbo is $1250aud (£690) we have intakes made at local fab for $450aud (£250) xforce downpipe $894aud (£490) this is why i laugh at forge new turbo inlet price. I have already sent template to local fab for the flange $80aud (£40) and silcone hose $30aud..
Let me know if you'd be willing to make 2 of those flanges, I'd be interested in giving it a shot too :p, and maybe it'll save a bit on the creation cost if they make a few vs. just one. I assume it would be a similar design to Forge's piece w/the venturi?
 
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loafer-N77

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sunnylunn

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Jul 7, 2019
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Longfield, Kent
Forge - great team of friendly, helpful people, top quality products and for me, great customer service. All of the parts help if you're getting a remap, and I'm not sure why you'd be disappointed if the numbers don't add up, its how it drives.
 

loafer-N77

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Forge - great team of friendly, helpful people, top quality products and for me, great customer service. All of the parts help if you're getting a remap, and I'm not sure why you'd be disappointed if the numbers don't add up, its how it drives.
Was this this supposed to be in another thread?!
 
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Kev_G

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Nthusiast
Mar 27, 2019
589
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Chester
New turbo upgrade option

Only issue is i find pumaspeed make something then get it copied a million times in china reducing quality. I hope they dont with the i30n but seems to be a common thing. They are already banging on about the mapping and pub figures
 
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loafer-N77

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Only issue is i find pumaspeed make something then get it copied a million times in china reducing quality. I hope they dont with the i30n but seems to be a common thing. They are already banging on about the mapping and pub figures
Not here to judge, just showing an available option :)

(What have you heard about the mapping? Pm to keep this thread on topic if you like.....)
 

Kev_G

Well-Known Member
Nthusiast
Mar 27, 2019
589
370
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Chester
Only issue is i find pumaspeed make something then get it copied a million times in china reducing quality. I hope they dont with the i30n but seems to be a common thing. They are already banging on about the mapping and pub figures
Update on pumaspeeds turbo and what they quote. It wont run anywhere near 420bhp...........

" Sadly my car only makes 365bhp which is down to the Pumaspeed turbo, to make that power it has to run quite a bit more boost than the zentrum turbo. So not only is the turbo not up to the job neither are Pumaspeed either! The customer service I've not had off them is very poor to say the least"