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Tuning JB4 and Non-PP Veloster N

#1
I have a non-performance pack (NPP) Veloster N and a Jb4. Thought I'd share some findings I've been collecting with my car to show how the tuning compares to the performance pack (PP) models.

As is well known, the NPP has 250 HP and pulls 260 ft/lbs to 4000rpms. The PP has 275 HP and pulls 260 ft/lbs to 4700rpms, based on data that Hyundai has published. I've suspected that this difference is entirely caused by tuning differences and it seems the datalogs show this.

So I've data logged my NPP and compared it to PP data based on ecu_psi data recorded by the jb4 data logger. What's interesting is that both models have around the same boost (14-15psi) up to 4000 rpms. However the NPP model quickly drops the boost to 11-12 whereas the PP model holds 14-15 to 5500 RPM before dropping off to 11-12 PSI. You can see that in the first graph below. It also confirms my feeling that the NPP stock tune has nice kick in the midrange but craps out noticeably thereafter.

So, with the JB4 tuner I've found you can create a map6 (custom) profile that uses the same boost offsets as map 2 until 4k rpm, and then uses map3 offsets above 4k rpm. This results in similar boost through the rpm range that others have posted for map2 on their PP cars. For those not aware, map2 is for 93 octane, and adds 5 lbs of boost, tapering off to 4 lbs on the top end. With the NPP you can add 6 lbs of boost above 4k, and then taper off later in the rpm range to achieve the same affect for 93 octane use.

The second screenshot is my current map 6. Below 4k, what I'm currently using is closer to map1 (lower boost) which helps ease 2nd gear wheel spin on the all-season tires I'm running for winter. However, 4500rpm and above is the map3 profile. Even so, boost peaks at just below 18 psi at around 4k and then then tapers to just above 16 psi at 6k rpms. I'm seeing full timing advance on all 4 cylinders, and intake air temps look reasonable. I could run an extra pound or two down in the low to mid-range, but I'll probably wait to do that once the summer tires go back on. The third screenshot is a graph of a third-gear pull in upper 50-degree (F) weather. The blue line is boost -- look how flat it is until 6k.

I'll have to say, with the custom tune, the feeling is much improved. I like the power delivery much better as it feels much more linear up to 6k. The boost kicks you back and then it keeps you there in the seat until 6k, which is where I normally shift.

I have not confirmed via dyno, but I don't see any reason why the NPP version with a tune would have any less horsepower than a PP with a tune. It does take a different boost map to get there. Regardless, it ends up being a pretty good bang for the buck as you can gain back the 25 HP deficit, plus gain the additional power a PP car would get with a jb4 tune.
 

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#2
The NPP and PP both use the same boost profile. The PP drops to 11-12 PSI at redline just like the non-PP. The only difference in the tunes are torque limiters, but even then they are very very close. On the dyno they make just about the same power.
 
#3
The NPP and PP both use the same boost profile. The PP drops to 11-12 PSI at redline just like the non-PP. The only difference in the tunes are torque limiters, but even then they are very very close. On the dyno they make just about the same power.
Correct -- they both do drop to 11-12 PSI at redline. However the PP holds 14-15 PSI between 4000-5500 before dropping to 11-12 PSI. The NPP's drops boost to 11-12 PSI after 4000rpms. This is according to JB4 datalogs I've observed of both cars.

I personally haven't seen anything in the way of good (same day, same dyno) dyno comparisons between the two models however. I just wanted to point what probably explains the difference in Hyundai's published specs between the two cars (25 HP more and holds peak torque 800 rpm longer for the PP).

I also wanted to show that the NPP needs a slightly different "tune" than the canned maps to get full boost in the 4000+ rpm range.
 
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cihkal

New Member
#4
This is a really awesome post, thank you so much for the info man!

My dad, bro, and I just installed a JB4 on my non-PP today. It's definitely an awesome addition!

My bro has a JB4 on his PP, so we did a pull from 30-115/120ish. We ended the pull basically dead even, but what you found explains what we saw. I pulled on him a bit pretty quickly because I had better throttle management for the conditions. He "jumped" forward to kill that gap in the top end near the end of our pull. We were both running map 2 with 93oct.

For reliability I'm gonna daily a map 6 based on your findings that will essentially make my non-PP have identical performance to a stock PP.
 

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#5
This is a really awesome post, thank you so much for the info man!

My dad, bro, and I just installed a JB4 on my non-PP today. It's definitely an awesome addition!

My bro has a JB4 on his PP, so we did a pull from 30-115/120ish. We ended the pull basically dead even, but what you found explains what we saw. I pulled on him a bit pretty quickly because I had better throttle management for the conditions. He "jumped" forward to kill that gap in the top end near the end of our pull. We were both running map 2 with 93oct.

For reliability I'm gonna daily a map 6 based on your findings that will essentially make my non-PP have identical performance to a stock PP.
That's a great idea! Even with the boost "corrected" you may still pull on that PP since the NPP model have roughly an 80 pound weight advantage! Too bad we can't store two user-defined maps...
 
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cihkal

New Member
#6
That's a great idea! Even with the boost "corrected" you may still pull on that PP since the NPP model have roughly an 80 pound weight advantage! Too bad we can't store two user-defined maps...
Funny you mention that, I never thought of the weight difference until my dad and bro pointed that out... makes perfect sense.

Storing two maps would be great! Then I would daily my "PP tune" and save your modified map 2 for the really fun days!
 

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#7
So I've played with the tune a little more. It looks like I can extend the 6 psi of boost a little higher into the RPM range and then taper it off a little more gradually. Did a couple of 3rd-gear pulls in 60 degree temps and observed no timing pull. Still getting full timing advance.

I was not able to increase boost on the top end more, either by extending the 6psi or by adding an additional pound of boost in the 5000-6000 rpm range. This is probably as much as I'm going to be able to run on 93 without affecting timing (either not advancing as much or actually dropping).
 

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#8
So I've played with the tune a little more. It looks like I can extend the 6 psi of boost a little higher into the RPM range and then taper it off a little more gradually. Did a couple of 3rd-gear pulls in 60 degree temps and observed no timing pull. Still getting full timing advance.

I was not able to increase boost on the top end more, either by extending the 6psi or by adding an additional pound of boost in the 5000-6000 rpm range. This is probably as much as I'm going to be able to run on 93 without affecting timing (either not advancing as much or actually dropping).
Where them logs at lol. My map 2 logs mirror your custom map settings. And as long as your logs are good I’d keep playing with the boost some more
 
#9
Where them logs at lol. My map 2 logs mirror your custom map settings. And as long as your logs are good I’d keep playing with the boost some more
Thanks for the confirmation that my custom map gets it pretty close to a PP car running map2. I've attached the graph of a 2nd-3rd gear run using settings in my previous post. This site doesn't seem to support csv files do I didn't upload the entire dump, just a screenshot of the most important params.

I'm getting full timing on all 4 cylinders. Any more and I do see a bit of timing pull on the top end, though I suppose I could possibly try and run a little more boost at 5500 and below.

Note that this data is from the v13 beta, and the release notes report that it scales the boost numbers up 10% to make jb4 readings more in-line with what external boost gauges report. I assume that testing was done based on stinger data, but I have no idea if that holds trues for the N... The firmware did increase the logged boost numbers.. It's not clear how the numbers were scaled but to me it seems like ecu_psi was inflated 10%. It makes numbers harder to compare with previous versions of the jb4 software.

Anyway, I think this map6 is a good starting point for a non-PP car.
 

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#10
Thanks for the confirmation that my custom map gets it pretty close to a PP car running map2. I've attached the graph of a 2nd-3rd gear run using settings in my previous post. This site doesn't seem to support csv files do I didn't upload the entire dump, just a screenshot of the most important params.

I'm getting full timing on all 4 cylinders. Any more and I do see a bit of timing pull on the top end, though I suppose I could possibly try and run a little more boost at 5500 and below.

Note that this data is from the v13 beta, and the release notes report that it scales the boost numbers up 10% to make jb4 readings more in-line with what external boost gauges report. I assume that testing was done based on stinger data, but I have no idea if that holds trues for the N... The firmware did increase the logged boost numbers.. It's not clear how the numbers were scaled but to me it seems like ecu_psi was inflated 10%. It makes numbers harder to compare with previous versions of the jb4 software.

Anyway, I think this map6 is a good starting point for a non-PP car.
B49CE237-34BD-409F-9F3B-084AA29E5907.png
Here’s my Map 2 with sh*t gas and 90° intake temps.
 

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